2001 Suzuki TL1000R vs. 2002 Honda CBR 954RR... another biased comparison.
 

I'm going to try to set this up like the Buell/Honda comparo I did a while ago...

Presence - Winner - TLR
Being a streetfighter guy, I think both of these bikes could use a good amount of Dremeling and some rattle can flat black paint... however, I can honestly say that the CBR probably just looks better. It's got harder lines and looks faster than the TLR. Now, there's nothing that OSP likes more than a chick with a nice fat ass... really, I do. The thing is, I am not too keen on a bike with a fat ass... and the TLR's rockin' some Oprah sized booty. Too much.

I will say this for the TLR though... the exhaust looks hot from the rear.

Now, part of presence is obviously sound. No comparison. The CBR sounds really fast, but the TLR sounds really PISSED OFF. The Yosh pipes really set it off and let that V-twin sing... Such a glorious tune it is. Simply from pure sound alone the TLR wins with overall presence.

Ergonomics - Winner - TLR
I was very surprised by the CBR in terms of comfort. Riding from Colorado Springs into NM, then over to Deal's Gap within 5 days certainly didn't sound like a good idea on that bike, but I'll be damned if it was pretty comfortable.

On the other hand the TLR just seems to fit me better. The seat to bar distance feels longer and the pegs don't feel so close to the seat. Overall, I just feel more stretched out on the TLR. The riding position in general feels more relaxed, but I've only put about 80 miles on it so it's hard to say how it will feel for the long haul.

It's worth noting as well that the CBR's seat is like a wrapped up hunk of concrete, but the TLR's is a little more plush. Again though, without putting a ton of miles on it, it's hard to say with any certainty... for now, the TLR is more comfortable.

Handling - Winner - TLR
Really it's not a fair comparison here. The CBR's fork seal started leaking before I even made it to The Gap, so I never got a true read for how well it should have handled. Combine that with the factory squared rear tire and the CBR was fighting a losing battle. I can say with certain confidence that the CBR would have been a great handling machine in prime condition... it was plenty capable even with it's issues.

To be fair, I don't really have enough time on the TLR to really support this, but I think it seems like a much more stable machine in the turns. It turns in quick enough, but just locks into a line like a pitbull on a toddler. When I first got onto the on ramp after acquiring the TLR I turned in and thought to myself, "This will certainly be the machine I first drag knee with." Very confidence inspiring.

Drivetrain - Winner - CBR
In reality, both the CBR and the TLR have slick shifting gearboxes that just scream high quality... The CBR just seems to shift a little easier, but that could simply be my lack of miles on the TLR.

Another difference comes with driveline lash. Both bikes suffer from it, but the TLR seems to handle it a little better. Again though, maybe it's just my inexperience with this bike.

In the event that more miles changes any of these thoughts, I'll be sure to update this thread.

Engine - Winner - TLR
Man, how drastically different these bikes are. When I first rode the TLR, it felt really, really SLOW... As much as it pains me to admit it, I was growing fond of the top end rush that the I4 provides. That being said, 10 minutes later I was over that shit and had a rock hard erection for the V-Twin.

I feel pretty confident that if I put the TLR on a diet and do a little tweaking, I won't miss the 15HP deficit the Honda creates. That being said, the damn TLR just sings and pulls like someone's sticking red hot razor blades up it's tailpipe. Me likey.

Overall - Winner - TLR
Damn it feels good to be back on a V-twin. The torque, the wicked vibrations, the SOUND... All motorcycles should be V-twins... or at least all motorcycle riders should at least experience a V-twin at some point in time. Best street machines ever conceived.

The TLR seems to fit me better in just about every way over the CBR... physically and more importantly, emotionally. This may be a motorcycle that I have to keep forever.

I love your biased comparo's. I also love Vtwins...so...:idk: But I have a hard time believing the CBR is out handled by the TLR. But...I've never ridden a CBR.


VTWIN FTMFW!

Yeah, I'd be interested in riding another 954 to see the difference... you know, one with fork oil and good tires.

congrats! TLR's are awesome!!!

I'm really glad that you like it buddy! I wish you could have given the SV1000 a try tho'. I've ridden both and I really liked the more "standard" feel of the SV,I've never been a big fan of the radial shock.

come north sometime :dthumb: im glad you found a bike that fits you better bro

I was actually going to meet up with a guy this weekend who had an '03 SV1k... the non-faired one... Had that guy not blown me off until tomorrow it may have been a different story. I was honestly considering holding out until I got to check out the SV, but after I rode the TLR it was over... I was sold.

Dude... seroiusly... I don't even have to read the comparo... v-twins will always win!!

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and agree with this statement.

hang on a sec, my eyes got stuck at the top mid roll

I had mt TLR for 2+ years...its was a great bike!! A bit heavy but comfortable like no other bike I have ever owned.

gd thing u got a i4, cuz would take one hell of a vtwin to produce the power needed to fix your eyes



im not a vtwin hater, but im not a blind follower lol

I'm not a blind follower. Can't say Gas is either or OSP. We've all ridden both I4 and Twins. And so have many people. Vtwins are great engines.

And I'd venture to say that people who own the TL's and the twins are opposite of the followers.

Good point.

blind follower was just fuckin with gas about that statement, ive internetually known u guys long enough to know u arent tards when it comes to bikes

the tlr is badass, id trade my gsxr for one

Absolutely. I remember the naysayers when I bought my Buell... Fuck 'em... If I had the money, I'd buy one again!

Now your talking like a rational individual.

My next rig might be another Buell. I'm no where near ready to get rid of the XB...but should a better option of mufflers come out...the 1125 might be next. Either that or a Duc Hyper.

I masturbate frequently to my Xaus/Hypermotard desktop image... I rode with a guy on a HM one time... I think he had Termi pipes... it sounded badass either way... I licked the headlight and he got pissed. It was tasty.

I heard a 1098 and a 848 both with Termi's recently...sounded like the bike was going to kill you. I like that in a motorcycle.

damn vtwin'ers lol

only cuz i got a bike strictly for drag racing now-wouldnt even think of the tlr for pullin double duty

that buell u got id trade the gsxr for too, both look gd, black and yellow, black and gold...hmmm daytona 675 se is on that trade list too.


osp-u planning on changing anything besides exhaust?

The yellow 675 is bad ass.


I wouldn't trade my Buell for ANY I4. No way no how.

Yes... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYRajKfZYb0

And I think I'm going to try to sell off the plastics... maybe get some track glass and rig up some easily removable headlight/taillight/signal combo... Flat black with glossy black graphics... Not sure what the theme will be though... Hell I might get all the plastics off and fall in love with it as is...

Stainless lines are certainly in the cards... and new fucking tires. Dunslop 208's on it now... Probably SS pads when I get the lines... Maybe rearsets... I dunno...

If I can some how afford one when I start shopping Id love to get a 848. One of the few twins that Id love to have.

Fuck that bike. I'm def. getting a Hyper before that. 2nd Duc on the list is a 999...then the 1098.

I'd love to have the twin cheeks in your AV pic. You know, mounted on my face.

I figured that from you, but Im more of the full fairing type. The 1098 is a close second then the 999.

Ill send her over when Im done. Have your shovel ready.

Fairings are just more shit to replace when you crash that bitch. :lol: I like bikes to look like they don't have enough parts to work properly.

That's damn near a Jesse James quote... I fully concur.

:lol: Ill give you that. I like them looks wise but I still cant quite picture myself owning one anytime soon.

You and I are on the same page.

Truth has been spoken many times in this thread.

though I do belive that my next bike would be a I4 or a triple (750 or 675) as a track slut only.
Love the twin for the street.

Speed Triple, kid.

for a track day slut? why? get a cheap ass I4

Its simple... think of all the baddest bikes... from rice to pasta to tea... all v-twins.

:orly::skep: u must be :drewpy::whistle:

:lol:


hey maybe u can trade a guy with black plastics...
http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/a...tro/tiller.jpg

but then u cant have this sweet bday cake
http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/a...thdayCakeC.jpg

I had a fully moded TLS, although comfy for all day. And I loved this bike. Mt current 929 in stock form whips its ass in every aspect. Roll on 929 will walk away from the twin. Stock suspension is almost better than the ohlins rear and upgraded front end on the TL. I had lighter rims for the tl and it still felt like a sled tipped over and the 929 just flicks back and forth.

I think you have a case of I love my bike.

Current ride
bone stock 929

previous twin
sv650 with cam swap, jetted, exhaust, braided line, upgrade front forks, 636 rear shock. Felt like a POS. Didnt own it a year.

Tl1000s bought new in 99
PC2
Full Ti Yosh exhaust
OZ rims
Forks with .90 springs gold valve and preload built by Pro shop
Ohlins rear shock
Harris rearsets
Braided line
EBC pro lite rotors
Sharkinz street kit
Scott Steering damper
Par Mod
Reworked wiring harness
Custom sprocket covers
Carbon screen
regeared for mountains
and probably a bunch of shit ive forgotten

Ran great, loved it to death. Was a great bike for years.

stock 929 will out run it , out perform it period. Just not as comfortable.

isnt the tls alot dif than the tlr? 929 maybe same as 954, idk.


but he did say biased review lol

what's the difference between the TLS and the TLR? :idk:

and he's said it was a bias comparison... he just likes the V-Twin. he's not saying the TLR out performs the 954... just that he prefers it.

There not too mush difference in the 2 bikes. The engines will swap out from one to the other. R has a little better FI system. S is the lighter of the 2. R came with heavier springs in the front and a hydrolic clutch. Most switch the clutch for the S. S and R both have alot of the same internal pieces. Same clutch although earilier S did have a slightly different clutch. Clutch is a first style slipper type clutch. Works best with a set of barnett springs in it.

Both bikes need help in the FI system, either a yosh box mapping or a PC with a custom map. Rear shocks on both need to be tossed for upgrades. Wheels are bricks. A nice lighter wheel up front makes a world of difference. Wiring is too be desired. The 30 amp starter relay is an issue. It needs to be removed and upgraded or made into a solid device inside the wiring harness. Once done is bullet proof. Removing the entire wiring harness and cutting the factory crimps and soldering the entire thing will greatly improve spark and spark plug life.

I could go on for a very very long time along with a few other members on this board that I know where long time owners and heavy modders of the models.

All in all between the R and S, it mostly boiled down to who put the more tme into it.

01 tlr
TL 1000 R 2001
Overall Length: 2 100 mm (82.6 in)
Overall Width: 740 mm (29.1 in)
Overall Height: 1 120 mm (44.0 in)
Seat Height: 825 mm (32.5 in)
Wheelbase: 1 395 mm (54.9 in)
Ground Clearance: 120 mm (4.7 in)
Dry Weight: 197 kg (434 lbs)
Engine type: Water-cooled 996 cc 4-stroke 90° V-twin, DOHC, TSCC, 8 valves. 135 hp (99,3 kW)/ 9.500 rpm, 106 Nm/ 7.500 rpm.

99tls
Overall Length: 2,065 mm (81.3 in)
Overall Width: 715 mm (28.1 in)
Overall Height: 1,175 mm (46.3 in)
Seat Height: 835 mm (32.9 in)
Wheelbase: 1,415 mm (55.7 in)
Ground Clearance: 140 mm (5.5 in)
Dry Weight: 187 kg (411 lbs)
Engine type: Water-cooled 996 cc 4-stroke 90° V-twin, DOHC, TSCC, 8 valves. 125 hp (92 kW)/ 8,500 rpm, 107.4 Nm/ 7,100 rpm.

dif frame, dif swingarm, thats just the visible stuff, so looking at this, i would assume they ride like two diff bikes, even tho alotta parts are compatible

All that and you miss the biggest difference of them all... TLR and TLS have totally different chassis... Part of the reason the TLS was dubbed 'the widowmaker' was because of it's poorly designed chassis, which amoungst other things caused the bike to be unstable (and crack frames).

Thank you.

oh really now?

http://www.italiaspeed.com/2006/cars...ici_rr/103.jpg

http://z.about.com/d/motorcycles/1/0..._front_3-4.jpg

http://members.fortunecity.com/roadr...onda-nr750.jpg

:whistle:

mumm... DESMO... :drool:

Switch the shock and the crack in the frame is gone,which wasnt the "widow maker" dub from the begining. Which is only to the 97/98 model that had the differnt ECU which is the more sought after , but didnt have the factory stabilizer on the steering. That they all have now.

The S actually won a race, the R never did.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OncEph4Qq8

This is from last night at a local custom bike shop (ReverCorsa.com).. the video is pretty poor quality (I only had my cell phone with me), so it does NOT do the bike justice at all.

Suffice it to say.. I had a private moment in front of a lot of people when that bike was running. :drool::drool:

OSP, you have a problem with the mainstream. I can understand this considering your personality, but honestly it makes your bike comparisons look like comparing bottle rockets and cruise missles.

when the hell did you buy a tiller?

Yeah, I pretty much don't like most things other most other people really do... I've always been like that, even when I was little. :idk:

I traded a guy for it yesterday. Put almost 300 miles on her so far... Totally lovin' it. There are a few things I need to do that will hopefully help me love it more:

Set up the suspension! It's way too soft for my fat ass as is... I'm showing like 6 preload marks and I know damn full well I should probably have it totally locked down... I need to find someone who knows what their doing first and foremost...

I gotta change the oil... I think maybe some synthetic will slicken up the gearbox a bit. I got pretty spoiled with the silky smoothness of the CBR and syn made the Buell loosen up... It's not bad, just different.

I want stainless lines and some good pads stat. The feel of the brakes was much better on the CBR... of course it had stainless lines... I'm pretty sure the calipers are a big gummed up as well.

I'm considering changing the gearing a bit... Probably go up two in the back and do the 520 conversion... I hammered it in for an indicated 165 today... the fastest I've ever gone... The thing was rock solid, scary stable... In fact, I decided to hammer it when I looked down and noticed I was already at 110... felt like 80... So giving myself less top speed potential is most certainly a good idea... hmm... maybe I shoudl go down three.

maybe you should go to the track with it. U do know a bike is more stable the faster you go, corrects?

damn those things are wheelie machines and your gonna GO DOWN?!

also remember for your road trips that's gonna murder your range and fuel economy :2cents:

Up 2 in the rear is a great gearing for it.

I would recommending sticking with steel sprockets and the 530 for mileage.
Be very careful with the oil drain plug, they are very known to strip out.

Braided lines will make the brakes ok with a decent set of pads.

IIRC set the forks around 5mm showing above the top clamp once you get the suspension set. That was about the most common setting on the TL, I would start adjusting from there. After the weight is set. You will feel the shift instantly and figure out where you like the front end yourself.

Tlzone and Tlplanet are you 2 best sources of info.

I am yet to wheelie this thing... Pretty good considering I wheelied the CBR all the fucking time... I'm sure it will happen one day...

Not worried about fuel economy... 3/4 of the time I ride mid way through the revs or higher anyway... Plus, it's a 996cc liquid cooled v-twin... Gas mileage was murdered long ago... Not to mention, stopping every 120 miles is not necessarily a bad thing...

Drewp ran our last group ride with all V-Twins (Buells, RC51, SV's).

He made the comment that it was different riding with I4 groups. Different sweet spots. All torque less top end.

I am biased toward v-twins as well. I think part of the draw is that they AREN'T I4's.

I4's are really refined and are fantastic machines. V-Twins are not as refined. They are rougher around the edges.

I want a bike that is hot, vibrates, smells like gas and burning souls, sounds like you are running a chainsaw through a snare drum, and scares the piss out of you at least once every time you take it out of the barn.

There are so many ways that I4's are superior to many V-Twins. There are so many ways that even with that superiority, I will pick a V-Twin over an I4 given the chance.


The TLR is on my short list of wanted bikes. Ducati, RC51, Moto Guzzi, Aprilia, are all on the list.

http://www.motoguzzi-us.com/Nuovi_mo...fx/zoom/30.jpg

Mmmmmmm. Dead Sexy.

goin down 3t? think u mean goin up....

it is when you're putting new rubber on it every 2 months. plus the wear on the engine will increase. and the chain. and the sprockets. but if it gets your rocks off who gives a flying fuck.

I'm already on TLzone... I just need some patience to start reading through all that stuff...

I will most certainly stick with steel sprockets for mileage... good idea staying with 530... or maybe go with some of those uber-cool long mileage ones and do the 520... gotta do more research...

I've seen lotsa guys, mostly TLS guys, going with Busa calipers... Not sure if that'd be worth it as the TLR already has 6-pots... Again, gotta read more...

true...

Busa are more for appearence. Your choice is 6 pot or 4 pot. The 4 pot are the better for overall feel and the 6 pot are for stopping. You have 6 pot already. Put a good set of lines and your set unless you want to mod cosmetic.

Good call. I was thinking as I was riding today... "I4's are sooooo smooth, refined, and boring... the v-twin has a SOUL..."

Fuck me, I'm retarded... yes, up...

Nah, I doubt it will have that big of an impact... I go through tires quickly anyway... and the wear on the engine... yeah, but I didn't buy the damn thing to putt around to bike nights... chain and sprockets... not worried about those either...

I sorta figured it was something goofy like that... Cosmetics aren't necessarily my thing either... In fact, I want it to look as ugly as possible.

best bike description ever for a thrill ride, sounds like my kawi--air cooled i4.

different strokes, u know the rest

unless its a racebike, vtwin sportbikes sound the best-second only to a triple

You go up 2 in the rear I was getting about 17K out of my chain and sprockets (530 DID with steel afam)
Fuel mileage isnt really effected until your romping the gas. Youll see about 100 a tank on/off throttle 120-140ish with the wind at your back HWY.

I dont know how much you sport ride. My TL felt really good running the Diablo Strada on the rear with a Diablo up fornt. Got very good mileage, and with the weight of the bike the sport touring tire did well even in the curves.

The question is... well, the questions are... Did you go -1 up front too? And is that 17k speedo-healed?

I sport ride as much as FL's straight, flat roads will allow it... So I try to drag knees through intersections mostly.

Diablos came stock on my Buell... I only got 3k out of the rears... Got less than that out of the 2CT's... of course, that's cause I got a nail in the rear... Had about 1k on the Road 2's, but never was in a position to push them at all...

I was probably going to run the Road 2's again considering the geography of this area... Although, I've been wanting to do a track day for a long, long time so maybe I'll try the 2ct's again... They were actually wearing really well before I got the nail... and they stuck like glue in the corners...

OSP you should come up and do the TWFix rally in late May. it's a trip... I know... but it's also a mini rally

dude. thats pretty stupid. and thats comming from a guy that fucked 2 guard rails this year.

wtf is a mini rally? we had 5 people show up to the last rally and didnt call it "mini".

either you come of you dont. slap a twfix sticker on it and i'll be there.

I say mini because the list only had like 5 regulars...

and yes... last year was sad... never again! I'll do everything possible to attend from now on... next 4 years should be good considering I can't deploy for that long.

Where is this said "rally"?

Stay away from the -1 up front. My speedo was probably more acurate +2 than it was stock. That might have had something to do with running a 180-55 instead of the OEM 190-50 and the speedo is off the front sprocket so going -1 on the front will throw it wayyyy off.

You could go 3 up in the rear and be happier than +2 -1. I tried it once the bike was very unsettled in corners vs RPM. +2 was almost perfect.

it's not the rally... it's the TWFix Track day... in shitville...

There will always be one exception. But for the most part I'm right!

And?

and go check out the thread I bumped... fucker

I found it cockholster.

haha i posted three exceptions. the NR750 got blocked though. talk about an engine, its a true shame honda never made the oval pistoned v4's available to us ordinary folk.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Ovalpiston.jpg

http://www.vsource.org/VFR-RVF_files/Images/nr1.jpg

then post up cum dumpster

u only posted three exceptions, but not the only three exceptions
the chop just rattled gman brain alil lol

i thought the nr sold to the public?

lots of valves there...

I was wondering if you had dropped a tooth in the front because I know that causes additional wear on the chain and front sprocket...

oh i agree that there are plenty more where that came from, just chose some of the most glaring ones

in very limited numbers @ $50,000 a pop. the chances of average joe myself ever aquiring one are extremely shitty. an f4 on the other hand i could swing by selling some toys and making some painful budget cuts.

its basically a v8 joined at the piston :drool:

I'm thinking about it chode smoker.

what the fuck is there to think about prostate licker

Why are you fucks queering up my thread? Go flirt some place else...

shut the hell up and go sign up for the track day

Still a V motor

not a vtwin tho, mr. technicality

yeah you clearly said v-twins buddy.

Hateeeeeeeeeers.

geesh... give a guy a break

Are people still fucking up this thread?:twfix:

pt barnum said no :sorry:

awesome fucking post!

if you dont like the tlr tail look into a 03 gixxer 1k tail mod, a lot of guys do it. Just need a bit of welding a 03 gixxer subframe and plastics.
________
Babimac
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Easy Vape Digital Hands Free Vaporizer

Now that sounds like an interesting option... I was thinking about just hacking the fucking thing off and solo-seating it...

tlzone.net they have 954 tail section mods 03 gixxer mods and i think a few others, i dont like most of the guys on that forum but some of them know their stuff.
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HONDA CB600F HISTORY
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Latin girl live

Ya know, the fact that all of the Japanese companies have pretty much all but given on on v-twin sportbikes really pisses me off...

Hey it's not the factories' fault. They have all presented the public with good V-Twins...we're just not buying them. Why should they keep selling bikes that no one is buying?:idk:

yep, its like elections. you vote with your dollars

well it also has to do with the I4's now compete'n with the Duc's in races... for a while the I4's couldn't compete well with the Duc's...

but the problem is people buy'n a spec sheet... like the new GSXR1000 has 180+hp so it must be the fastest (i have no idea what the new bikes make just making a point)

I was talk'n to a couple guys the other day... talk'n about buy'n a new bike. I mentioned I want either a GSXR or CBR600RR 06-09... and they were both quote'n what the 09's were puting out in hp... oh the GSXR is putting out 120hp this year... no way you'll want the 06 with only 110 or so... :lol: yeah cause that extra 20hp is worth the extra 4g's it'll cost me.

wasnt it the other way? thats why duc's get the extra displacement, 1200 vs 1000cc i thought.